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Wikipedia user pages with the most page watchers?

Hey everyone

I’d like to find out which Wikipedia editors have the most people watching their user pages. Is there a way I can find this information, or ask someone really smart to find out? Tykeshay (talk) 01:40, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

@Tykeshay The most-watched userpage/talkpage is likely to be for User_talk:Jimbo_Wales, at 4103 currently. It is also the most-read and probably the one with the biggest archive. You can use the "page information" tool on any userpage to see the number of watchers it has, just as you can with articles. There is probably a way to do what you want with one of the tools at Toolforge and that's where you should ask. Note that for privacy reasons you can't find out which pages any specific user is watching. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:52, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Ok so how do I ask for someone to run that report? Can someone please help me do that? Tykeshay (talk) 04:22, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Tykeshay, the documentation at WP:DBR/MWU (which is what you want, just seven years out of date) says you might be able to request the database report be run again at Wikipedia talk:Database reports. Folly Mox (talk) 11:54, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Memorable editing tales?

The more I get involved in Wiki editing and read Teahouse and Help Desk replies from senior editors, the more I’m curious if somewhere there’s a collection of stories about intriguing editing situations they’ve been been involved in over the years. I can just picture the old-timers sitting around a campfire under the stars sharing memorable tales.

Augnablik (talk) 02:50, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Some of this may be of interest:

• WP:HOAXLIST
• WP:LAME
• WP:PRESS 24
• WP:SIGNPOST
• Depths of Wikipedia
• Wikipediocracy
• User:JPxG/Oracle/Largest AfDs

Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 06:39, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you, @Gråbergs Gråa Sång … you’ve certainly expanded my to-do list exponentially! I delved into your first suggestion, WP:HOAXLIST, and found myself alternately in laughter and horror that so many hoaxes had actually gotten through Wikipedia’s security posts — even if they amount to only something like 1% of all posts. That’s 1% too many.

I think I have my reading all cut out for me over the next week, with your suggested list. Augnablik (talk) 09:29, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@Augnablik One more: WP:CITOGENESIS. This [1] is a favorite of mine. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:46, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@Augnablik You might find some of the 'hairiest tales' being dewscribed during the week-long discussion process when an editor applies to become an administrator. Quite ofte,n the applicants are asked to describe difficult or challenging editing situations they have found themselves having to deal with. You can read mine here, and you simply have to change the url by replacing the username of the editor you're interested in hearing more from.

Sometimes the questioners tease out fascinating issues the applicant has encountered - sometimes dealing with them well; other times not. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 09:59, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

My already long reading list provided by @Gråbergs Gråa Sång has expanded hugely with your suggestion to read “some of the ‘hairiest tales’ … during the week-long discussion process when an editor applies to become an administrator."

Actually, Nick, this will probably surprise you but it's the second time that I’ve read your write-up for your exam week. The first was a few months ago when, as has occurred with some frequency, you gave me a particularly helpful answer to one of my questions in the Teahouse. I don’t remember what that question was, but I do remember the deep resonance I felt. So I decided to find out more about you. When I went to your user page, I eventually found a link to your write-up.

Reading it made me feel an even closer bond with you and the other senior editors as well, even those I hadn’t yet connected with, as I became aware of some of the behind-the-scenes work you’ve all had to carry on. I think it must have been through reading your write-up that I felt an unusually strong sense of commitment to the Wikipedia mission and of belonging in its editor community that brought me to a much further point than no accumulation of editor points could have.

I hope all editors get to find out about such stories from your merry band. Augnablik (talk) 10:45, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

And for a (somewhat) fictitious cases, but based on "real" events, and also and to highlight the sometimes very pronounced hairiness of Wiki-bureaucracy, see WP:LIGHTBULB and Wikipedia:No climbing the Reichstag dressed as Spider-Man. Maybe also the BJAODN part of Wikipedia:Silly Things. Lectonar (talk) 11:36, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

😱 WP:LIGHTBULB is a scream, @Lectonar! Once recuperated from the acute hilarity attack it brought on, I'll get to your other suggestions. Augnablik (talk) 16:56, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@Augnablik What a kind thing to say! Thank you. I'm glad my and others efforts here have inspired you. That's precisely what we need in order to ensure a good supply of younger enthusiastic and committed editors. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 16:09, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Question

I noticed on the page for “List of Point Horror books” it is incomplete. Now, there is a YouTube channel i watch who has a near complete collection of the books. Whould it be appropriate to add the missing entries shown in the video? Blackmamba31248 (talk) 20:17, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Point Horror § Publications Deor (talk) 22:02, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Huh? Where you answering my question? Blackmamba31248 (talk) 00:29, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

A "Courtesy link" is made so that Teahouse Hosts know where the problem - in ths instance the incomplete list - is located. David notMD (talk) 02:56, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

My apologies. Blackmamba31248 (talk) 03:07, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Blackmamba31248. If a reliable publisher has published a list of the books in any form (including on their official youtube channel) we can cite it. If a random person (even a famous one) talks on YouTube or anywhere else about the list of titles, that is not a reliable published source and we cannot use it. ColinFine (talk) 14:04, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

What’s the diffrence? I’ll cite the video and i guess that up for a Teahouse host to decide. Can’t do it now because I’m at school and YouTube is obvisouly blocked. Blackmamba31248 (talk) 14:40, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Here is the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsumVwZwFVY Blackmamba31248 (talk) 22:09, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Also, about the reliability, the guy in the video talks about how he has been reading and collecting the books since he was a child. Blackmamba31248 (talk) 22:12, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Talking of citing "a Youtube channel", Blackmamba31248, is a little like talking of citing "something that's printed". A specific video could be excellent; it could be worthless. I suggest that you rewrite your question above, providing the links to a small number of representative examples among these videos, and that you then post the result not here but instead (and with an informative heading) to WP:RSN. -- Hoary (talk) 08:08, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Does having taken classes from a professor place me too close?

I would like to create a page for a biologist that I took some classes from in the 1970s. I believe I can be objective. Also I have a photograph that I took of the professor back then. Is it OK to use this photo? He died in 1983. Thank you. Jimpittssky (talk) 01:44, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Please check Wikipedia's notability guidelines to see if your biologist qualifies for an article. ABG (Talk/Report any mistakes here) 02:01, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

See WP:NACADEMIC. Did the biologist hold an endowed chair at a well-known institution? Awarded significant science awards? Written about? You photo would be OK, but does not factor into establishing notability. David notMD (talk) 03:02, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for your comments. The Biologist was William Clay at the University of Louisville. In addition to his work with fishes, he was also describer of a new species of water snake and documenter of the genus Natrix. He became professor emeritus with more than 35 years of teaching and research at the institution. He wrote a Field Manual of Kentucky Fishes (1962) and The Fishes of Kentucky (1976). There are no web pages dedicated to him. Opinion? Jimpittssky (talk) 03:31, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Sounds far more interesting to me than the thousands of soccer players we have articles on. (Before anyone gets offended, the same applies to almost all our sports person articles.) HiLo48 (talk) 03:43, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your fearless encouragement! Jimpittssky (talk) 04:28, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Conflict of interest seems to have been particularly on @Jimpittssky's mind when he titled his original message, "Does having taken classes from a professor place me too close?" So aside from answering the question of the professor's notability, JimP. would also have to make a declaration of COI. Augnablik (talk) 07:25, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Some of my lecturers/professors from back in the 1960s and 70s have Wikipedia articles. I didn't create them, but have made some edits. I don't think having been a student of a now deceased person that long ago demands a declaration. HiLo48 (talk) 07:42, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@Jimpittssky As you are a newcomer here, I assume you will use the articles for creation process. Even folk with a WP:COI are allowed to create drafts using that method, so I don't think that this is an obstacle. Disclosure does no harm (e.g. on the Talk Page of the draft) but actually I agree with HiLo48 that classes 50-years ago are pretty irrelevant. Good luck: we need more articles on academics. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:21, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you @Michael D. Turnbull I am beginning to think that the COI is not so bad. @David notMD was questioning the notability of the subject. I really would like to have some confidence that the article would not be rejected on that basis before proceeding, but perhaps that is more than I should ask. Thank you for your encouragement. Jimpittssky (talk) 20:17, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia makes a distinction between Declined (not good enough yet) and Rejected (not good). Submitting a properly referenced draft gets a Reviewer's reasons, if Declined. List of University of Louisville people has a Notable faculty section that provides examples. David notMD (talk) 20:26, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@Jimpittssky, your main goal is going to be finding reliable sources to prove notability - usually if you can find three good sources that's enough to start with. It sounds like you have some academic experience, which may help because you already know having a few really solid articles or books about your subject is better than having a hundred no-peer-review, vanity-publisher pieces. Have a good read through the reliable sources page and the list of perennial reliable sources, and if you're really unsure about something the reliable source noticeboard seem to enjoy prying good sources out of the detritus of the internet. Good luck and happy editing! StartGrammarTime (talk) 01:04, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Title for a9 dualling project in scotland and help

There are various titles that could be used for the A9 project in Scotland including the official A9 dualling Perth to Inverness plus many others like A9 Perth to Inverness. However, I proposed to title it A9 dualling project. I am allowed to copy stuff from A9 road (Scotland) to make sure that I do not claim that I did it myself? I know I cannot use Wikipedia as sources, but what about copying it? I started my draft here. JuniperChill (talk) 10:55, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@JuniperChill See WP:CWW for the guidance. The more usual case is for translations from other-language Wikipedias (WP:TRANSLATE). Note that there should be no need for massive duplication: you can always add a {{see also}} or similar to the head of one of your article's sections. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:44, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@JuniperChill Welcome to the Teahouse. It's difficult at this early stage to know what sources and content you will eventually have, but my feeling is that you would be best to start off by keeping everything together, and simply create a sub-section within A9_road_(Scotland)#Upgrades. If it then becomes so expansive that it deserves its own article, then you can add a section hatnote to refer to the relevant main article.

Yes, you are permitted to copy content from one Wikipedia article to another. You should make an edit summary for that copy/paste action which gives attribution to the authors. You do this by stating what you're copying and linking to that page (see HERE). It is also possible to mirror a section of text so that any changes made to the main paragraph also appear automatically in the new article. But you'd need to think through the need for this, and why you're creating a brand new page for something that could simply be included in the original article. Nick Moyes (talk) 11:44, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

I was just thinking the reason why I feel as though the A9 project in Scotland deserves a page of its own is because it is not a normal road construction project. Dualling a 10 mile section of road is definitely not worth a page, but for 80 miles and £3 billion, sure. We have lots of small road projects going on, like adding cycling lanes, making residential and city streets 20 mph, and there are too many of them to be listed as a page of its own, or even included in an existing page. Plus, it is covered in many reliable sources. Not only that, but it was supposed to be complete in 2025, but only two sections (out of 11) have been done today, far from it. But will see how it goes JuniperChill (talk) 12:14, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

I have started a conversation at Talk:A9 road (Scotland)#Splitting proposal to see whether other editors agree on whether the project should have its own page. JuniperChill (talk) 14:55, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello! Questions on a taken Username and Account Creation.

Hello! I have been discovering along Wikipedia and I want to make a new account or change a username. My friends mostly know my persona to be based around one of Alice Oseman's book characters Tori Spring, off Solitaire and the Heartstopper Universe. (I tend to see my life is as close as hers and she is one of my faves of all time! I read Solitaire loads :]) I tried making an account as tori_spring, however it seems to be taken (or its near identical!) Any help finding a solution to this conundrum? It would help lots! -tori :) (This is an old account with a username or name I no longer associate with!) Im Haymarket (talk) 13:49, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi Im Haymarket, User:Tori Spring was created on 20 June 2022, and has never edited the English Wikipedia but was first created on the Spanish Wikipedia, which is deemed to be their "home wiki", as shown here, although they have never edited any Wikiproject.
In these circumstances, you cannot follow the general advice at Wikipedia:Changing username/Usurpations although you could try Meta, as is linked on that page. I don't know how difficult that is, or if you are likely to succeed. Alternatively, I suggest you try a similar name, but not too similar e.g. not Tori Spring 1. Best wishes - Arjayay (talk) 14:05, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Consider ToriSpringFan. David notMD (talk) 14:11, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

I think i'll take this approach :)

cheers alot Im Haymarket (talk) 07:34, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Error message

Hi! I wrote a draft of an article for the actor Filip Geljo: Draft: Filip Geljo. But when I tried to move it to the mainspace, it gave me an error message that said "The page could not be moved: a page of that name already exists, or the name you have chosen is not valid." I'm not sure why this is happening, as no Filip Geljo page exists (besides the one I wrote). I have published articles before and not encountered this problem, so I'm confused. Schtamangie (talk) 18:04, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Ok, I figured it out. Apparently "Filip Geljo" was a redirect. So I edited that page and put the article I wrote on instead of the redirect. This might seem like a silly question, but how do I delete my draft? Or what should I do now that the draft still exists as a different page? Schtamangie (talk) 19:41, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@Schtamangie: You can redirect the draft to the article like if it had been moved, or request deletion with {{db-g7}}. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:13, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you @PrimeHunter! I made it a redirect. Schtamangie (talk) 21:23, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@Schtamangie: Which of the sources cited in the article establish Geljo's Wikipedia notability per WP:NACTOR or WP:BIO? None of them (at least at first glance) seem to be the kind of WP:SIGCOV generally needed to establish Wikipedia notability. Perhaps, that's why the article was a redirect for so long? The redirect actually was protected by an Wikipedia administrator named Schwede66 because of persistent vandalism in the past, and protection might now extend to the article you created. -- Marchjuly (talk) 10:20, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Marchjuly, thank you for your concern. Two things:

Firstly, based on WP:NACTOR and WP:BIO, Geljo is notable on both criteria. He has definitely had significant roles (a starring role in a children's TV show and a role in Avatar: The Way of Water, among others). He has also definitely been covered in multiple reliable sources, including Variety, Mashable, The Direct, Screen Rant, and others. If you think I should add additional sources to the article, I'd be happy to!

As to the redirect protection, I was unsure if I should put the protection on the article. What is the proper protocol for this?

Thank you! Schtamangie (talk) 13:06, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi Schtamangie Are his appearances in the children's TV show and the Avatar film significant roles or minor supporting roles? The Legit source seems unreliable to me and nothing but a PR type ofsite. He's only mentioned once by name in the Variety article, and just twice by name in the The Wrap article; so, neither source is going to be considered significant coverage. I don't see either him or his character even mentioned in the People orr the Inverse articles cited in the article; so, they're value is establishing notability is zero. That leaves the brief paragraph about him in the 24/7 Wall St article and more extensive write up in the Looper article goes into more detail, but I'm not sure those would be enough for the article to survive an AfD nomination. If he's received significant coverage in the other sources you've mentioned above, you should add citations to them to the article because (once again) as is his Wikipedia notability seems quite questionable to me and it might be a case of WP:TOOSOON. -- Marchjuly (talk) 13:30, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

His appearance in the children's TV show (Odd Squad), was a major role; he was one of two main characters that made up a duo that solved "odd" situations :). In Avatar, he had a more minor role, but still a relatively important one. I can remove the Legit article if you think so. Respectfully, the Variety article is about him and the other main actor from Odd Squad (Dalila Bela) leaving the show. He is also mentioned in other articles, but those articles mainly repeated the same basic information, so I didn't think it worthwhile to add them to the source list.

To me, based on the coverage he has received, I think he meets Wiki's notability guidelines. I understand that "significant" is a subjective term, but based on WP:SIGCOV, where it says Geljo (or any topic) "does not need to be the main topic of the source material," I definitely think he has received "significant coverage."

I'm also still confused about the redirect protection. Should I add the protection back? Schtamangie (talk) 13:50, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I have removed the protection from the article as it’s no longer a redirect. Schwede66 15:25, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! Schtamangie (talk) 15:30, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

What's the best way to get a redirect removed?

The Irish radio station, TodayFM, released a number of cover albums in the 2000s. This article has the high level details Even Better Than the Real Thing album series. While looking at the pages for each album I saw that volume 3 redirects to the U2 wikipedia page. I think this is a mistake. I'd like to see the page reinstated. What's the best way to go about this? Kertap (talk) 18:50, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

You can just undo this edit. Ruslik_Zero 19:35, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your help Kertap (talk) 15:43, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

What counts as “reliable sources”?

I’ve recently been editing the draft for the Draft:Whatever (channel). I’ve been looking for reliable source regarding this channel. However from what I’ve seen for reliable sources it can include news articles, which is what I mostly found regarding this however I can’t really find anything scholarly considering this is a youtube channel that’s been going viral for some time now. (Discopleasant (talk) 21:53, 13 May 2024 (UTC))

Hello Discopleasant and welcome to the teahouse. Most major news sites are considered reliable, but there are exceptions, including most of the websites you cited. This page lists some common websites and the consensus on their reliability. Additionally, I recommend you install this script that highlights common sources based on their reliability. Finally, if you ever have questions about a source not listed, you can search the archives at this board about the reliability of sources or ask a question if you can't find anything. Sincerely, Dilettante 22:01, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Can someone explain to me how the sandbox works?

Hey everybody, I was wondering about what the sandbox is meant for and why it would be used in the first place. If there's anybody who could explain this to me, please reply ASAP, thank you! - engineer gaming ^{talk | contribs} 22:09, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@ENGINEERGAMING88 It's mainly for testing stuff, I used mine pretty much solely for futzing about with my signature and making sure it worked properly.

You can also use it to create drafts when you feel like making your first article, but I tend to just create subpages of my own in my user space for that purpose. CommissarDoggo^Talk? 22:22, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

There is the general Sandbox, which is blanked several times a day, and your own Sandbox. If there is a section of an article I wish to edit, I click Edit for the section, copy all content to my Sandbox as a section, revise there, delete/add refs there, then use all that to replace the section of the article. David notMD (talk) 03:52, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@ENGINEERGAMING88 More at Help:Sandbox. Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:22, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

So it's like a way to work on edits before publishing them, that's super useful! Thank you for helping me understand some of the sandbox's uses! - engineer gaming ^{talk | contribs} 12:32, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Can also contain a reminder list of articles you intend to work on. And a place to get reference format right before adding a ref to an article. David notMD (talk) 14:20, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Formal rename request

Background We're looking for help coming up with a title name that is more inclusive than Murders of Tylee Ryan and J. J. Vallow. So far, no luck. (See the talk page if interested).

"Formal renaming request" Someone mentioned a "formal renaming request". I have been searching but I cannot find anything about this. Do you know how to request assistance with coming up with an article title when we are stumped? Thanks so much!–CaroleHenson (talk) 22:37, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Is this the wrong place to ask the question?–CaroleHenson (talk) 04:17, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@CaroleHenson Welcome to the Teahouse. We try to answer any question here, or point people to somewhere else where they should get an answer. The title of articles comes within the manual of style and the policy for that is given at WP:TITLE. In your Talk Page discussion, arguments based on policy should win out. One possibility if you can't reach consensus with others in discussion is to alert editors from interested Projects via a neutrally-worded request on a Project Talk Page to come and comment (see WP:CANVASS). Don't forget that WP:Redirects can be used for article titles, so in the end it may not matter much which title is the one used if there are several nearly-equal options. Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:18, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, Michael D. Turnbull.–CaroleHenson (talk) 14:25, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Question

hello, i was wondering when i can use the twinkle bot because it doesnt let me use it. GoodHue291 (talk) 23:01, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@GoodHue291 You need to be WP:AUTOCONFIRMED, meaning you need to have made at least 10 edits and have created your account at least four days ago. You'll have to make at least another 6 edits and wait at least another 3 days. CommissarDoggo^Talk? 23:06, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Alright, thank you. GoodHue291 (talk) 20:26, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

How to publish?

I am new and have never published a wikipedia entry. I have written a draft wikipedia entry at:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:XuhuaXia

but have two problems: 1) The entry is supposed to have a title "Xuhua Xia", but it shows "User:XuhuaXia" instead. How to change "User:XuhuaXia" to "Xuhua Xia"? 2) I expect the entry title "Xuhua Xia" to be searchable within Wikipedia. However, it is invisible. XuhuaXia (talk) 02:07, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@XuhuaXia: Please read WP:AUTO on why autobiographies are strongly discouraged. It reads more like a resume than an encyclopedia article. RudolfRed (talk) 02:18, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@XuhuaXia Your user page has been deleted under WP:U5. Please see WP:UPGOOD and WP:YFA. '''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk • contribs) 02:32, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

If you really, really, truely, truely believe that you are famous enough to be the subject of an article - meaning that people who do not know you personally have published content in reliable sources about you - then use WP:YFA to create a draft. But only after reading WP:AUTO to learn why people almost always fail to crate an article about themselves. David notMD (talk) 03:59, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

New article

How can I create a new article Blow.ofmind78 (talk) 03:10, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks Blow.ofmind78 (talk) 03:12, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

It's possible with a mobile device? Blow.ofmind78 (talk) 03:13, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Question was answered on their talk page. Drmies (talk) 03:14, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks Blow.ofmind78 (talk) 03:18, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Unclaimed Moneys in Banks in the U K

I recently discovered my Father left me Money in 1955, as per his Probated Will. I never knew where my Father banked. Frustrated after writing to banks and Building Societies, I wrote to the Chancellor of the Exchequer, no real response from any of them. Registered with the Web Site 'My lost Account' for the second time, again nothing. as I understand Dormant Accounts after 15 years Banks forward the moneys to the Government for safe keeping. How and when do the Banks Transfer the Moneys, and which Department receives it. I am 89 so 69 years have passed since my Father died, there must be some Bank employees out there who can direct me, please do so. Jamiesonandy (talk) 04:11, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@Jamiesonandy: The Teahouse is for asking questions for how to use Wikipedia. We can't help with other matters. RudolfRed (talk) 04:24, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Difficulty getting an edit accepted

This is the first time I've really ever made an edit. I heard a new song by The Decemberists called 'Joan in the Garden' (which is about Joan of Arc) and it sent me down a rabbit hole that ended on the Cultural Depictions of Joan of Arc page. I noticed that the song was not present under the page's music section, and I thought it would make sense to add it.

I did so, and my edit was quickly removed, with the other user informing me that a source was needed. I found an article about the album, containing a quote from the songwriter, in which he stated very clearly that he was attempting to depict Joan of Arc in the song. This edit was rejected as well, with the same user claiming that it was 'Just a PR release'. He asked to bring the discussion to this talk page, where he informed me that I would need a 'source that is 'independent of its subject.'

Our conversation can be seen on the talk page linked above, and the user eventually suggested that I go here for clarification. My point of view is that the main criteria to include an a work on that page should be whether or not it can be reasonably proven that the work does depict Joan of Arc. If that is the case, then wouldn't a direct quote from the author of the work be the perfect source in that context?

Please, if there's anything about my thinking that goes against Wikipedia's standards, I'd be more than happy to be educated. I'm just not really sure what I could do to get this edit added. Theda19 (talk) 04:38, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Theda19: I don't think this is the definitive answer, but as no one else has offered one yet, I'll chip in with my two pennies.

I think we can take a close primary source to verify that the song really does depict Joan of Arc; after all, who would know this better than the person who wrote the song?

But that does not, in and of itself, mean that this song should be mentioned in that article, as it may not be notable enough to justify that (it doesn't have an article itself, and gets only a passing mention in the The Decemberists article). By contrast, eg. the Madonna song Joan of Arc which is listed there does have its own article, and is clearly notable, and therefore can be easily referred to in the Joan of Arc article.

In other words, I'm suggesting that notability should be the inclusion criterion for the list of cultural depictions in that article. A parallel could be drawn to lists of 'notable people' or 'notable alumni' found in many articles (see eg. Rotterdam#Notable people and Istanbul University#Notable alumni), where 'notable' means 'they have Wikipedia articles'.

(But, even assuming my rationale here is right, does that mean the said song absolutely cannot be included in the Joan of Arc article unless it first has its own article? No, I wouldn't go quite so far. But I am leaning in that direction, yes.)

HTH, -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 09:29, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Fair enough. The notability question is a whole different thing, and I could completely understand that basis for not including it. (Although by that logic, there are probably also several entries in that section that should likely be pruned. And maybe that would be a good thing, I really don't know.)

I mostly wanted some clarification on the inadequate source argument the other person was making. As I'm new to this, I couldn't quite tell if they were being unreasonable, or if that's just how Wikipedia is intended to function. They also were very quick to ask me if I had any conflicts of interests, or if I were a paid editor, so maybe there's something else going on here that I'm unaware of.

Either way, I appreciate your feedback in helping a newbie navigate this stuff. Theda19 (talk) 13:04, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

DoubleGrazing (and Theda19), I disagree with the proposition that only things wiki-notable in their own right should be mentioned (if relevant) in another article, let alone that they should both be notable and already have their own article. Without having the chops to do the analyses, I'd guess that strict application of this would remove more than half of all referenced 'facts' in Wikipedia.

The Decemberists are notable, the song is undoubtably theirs, it is relevant to the list in question, and that relevance has been well (if not completely independently) referenced. By my count, 20 out of the 47 songs already in the table also do not have their own article – nor do three of the artists. I think Xxanthippe is being over zealous; perhaps they would like to link to an actual written policy rather than talking vaguely about "contentious areas".

[Disclaimer: I have no previous involvement or interest in this matter, having only read of it on this desk, and I wouldn't recognise The Decemberists if I heard them.] {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 188.220.175.176 (talk) 16:31, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

What would be the typical procedure in a situation like this if I want to get my edit added? Theda19 (talk) 16:36, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Note, I also actually previously mentioned on the talk page for the article the fact that many of the entries on the list didn't have sources. Xxanthippe responded by linking the following page: WP:OTHERSTUFF, which didn't feel particularly constructive given the context. Theda19 (talk) 16:45, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Article assessment

What's the difference between all the different class articles and how do reviewers classify articles as either stubs/starts or something more? thanks. TheBrowniess (talk) 06:22, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@TheBrowniess, Read WP:Assessment. Grabup (talk) 06:30, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks TheBrowniess (talk) 06:37, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I'd add that in my view a lot of editors don't pay much attention to article classes other than FA and GA these days. Others may disagree with that assessment, though. Cordless Larry (talk) 07:06, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I guess because those are the articles that get the most page views. TheBrowniess (talk) 07:14, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Yes, but my sense is that people used to take article assessment more seriously in the earlier days of Wikipedia, including the lower article classes. Cordless Larry (talk) 07:40, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

At the other end to GA/FA, stubs are still tracked and sometimes acted upon, but otherwise your assessment that the other classes have become less meaningful seems correct. CMD (talk) 07:52, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Also decreased chances of edit warring and conflict due to less scrutiny overall, perhaps. TheBrowniess (talk) 09:44, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

This conversation from 2021 is illuminating, if you're interested in this topic. Folly Mox (talk) 12:06, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for sharing! I'll read it when I have the time. TheBrowniess (talk) 12:19, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

About Draft, userpage, Article and 'move' tool

So I created a "Battle of Vovchansk" page on my userpage. When I thought it was done, I immediately copied and pasted it into the article I created. However, I just found out that this is not allowed, so I should have used the "Move" tool. My question is, I have tried using the Move tool to the Battle of Vovchansk article but it doesn't work. I also tried it on Draft:Battle of Vovchansk but it still doesn't work. So what should I do? Do I have to wait for the Battle of Vovchansk article to be deleted before requesting the article I created on my userpage? But on the other hand, someone has already created a draft of it. This is confusing me. Bukansatya (talk) 09:56, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi Bukansatya, welcome to the Teahouse. Copy-pasting is allowed by Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia when you are the sole contributor of the content like here. Otherwise we use a move to preserve the page history with credit to other contributors. The tiny Draft:Battle of Vovchansk had other content and has been redirected to Battle of Vovchansk. Nothing more has to be done but unless you plan to use it for draft edits, I suggest you either redirect User:Bukansatya/Battle of Vovchansk to Battle of Vovchansk or request deletion with {{db-u1}}. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:55, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Alright, thank you for answering. Bukansatya (talk) 12:04, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

About a good article

How to know if my article I wrote in my sandbox is good enough so it won't be removed? Draykaayrg (talk) 11:25, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Draykaayrg Hello. You submit it for a review; I will move it to Draft space and add the appropriate information so you can do so.

Please describe your connection to this musician, as you uploaded a professionally taken image of him and claimed it as your own personal work. 331dot (talk) 11:30, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Please ma/sir I'm the musician 🙏🏿 Draykaayrg (talk) 11:46, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Oh, you are writing about yourself. This is not a good idea, please see the autobiography policy; it isn't forbidden, but inadvisable. 331dot (talk) 11:31, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Now at Draft:Draykaay. 331dot (talk) 11:33, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Please how can I submit it for review? Draykaayrg (talk) 11:34, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Please I couldn't find the article I wrote anymore 😭 Draykaayrg (talk) 11:35, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

It is now located at Draft:Draykaay. I've added the information to allow you to submit it. You may just click the "submit your draft for review!" button on the screen in the box at the top of the draft. I advise you to not do so yet, as it is not likely to be accepted. It isn't a good idea to be writing about yourself at all, but if you wish to proceed, you need to remove language about your passion for music and other promotional language, and write in a very dry, matter of fact manner. You need to set aside everything you know about yourself and only write based on the content of independent reliable sources. You also need to show that you meet the special Wikipedia definition of a notable musician. This is usually very difficult for people to do about themselves. 331dot (talk) 11:38, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Haa, thank you so much for your concern you really a good person. Draykaayrg (talk) 11:41, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I'm going to remove that part I said passion

Please is there any other mistakes I should avoid in my article? Draykaayrg (talk) 11:43, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

You have not shown how you meet the special Wikipedia definition of a notable musician. 331dot (talk) 11:44, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I don't know if this may sound weird but I'm still an up and coming musician Draykaayrg (talk) 11:48, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

If you are an "up and coming musician", I wish you luck with your career, but you do not yet merit a Wikipedia article. Once you meet at least one aspect of the definition of a notable musician, there can be an article about you. It would be best if you or someone associated with you like a friend or agent were not the one to write it. I suggest that you go on about your career and when an independent editor takes note of coverage of you in independent sources, they will choose to write about you at that time. 331dot (talk) 11:53, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

The fact that you wished me good luck in my career means a lot to me.

That means you mean the problem is that my name haven't been mentioned in any reliable sources? Draykaayrg (talk) 11:57, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

The issue is that independent reliable sources have not taken notice of your career and chosen on their own to write about you and how you are a notable musician as Wikipedia defines it. We aren't looking for a brief mention, but significant coverage of you that details what makes you a notable musician. To put this another way, Wikipedia is the last place to write about a topic, not the first. Wikipedia summarizes what others say about topics. Once you are no longer up and coming, and have arrived as a musician, then an article about you (ideally written by someone not associated with you, or you) can be considered. You can't use Wikipedia to aid your career. If you want to introduce yourself to the world, that is precisely what social media and a personal/professional website are for. I encourage you to direct your efforts there, and go on about your career as if you had never heard of Wikipedia. 331dot (talk) 12:03, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Okay thanks I appreciate. I'm not going to submit it or move it to main space till I'm fully a musician. Please can you move it back to my sandbox please 🙏🏿🙏🏿 I'm not going to submit or publish it as I said, rather focus on my craft 🙏🏿 Draykaayrg (talk) 12:09, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

It's best for drafts to remain in draft space where they have an actual title. While sandboxes can be used to create drafts, they are meant for more general experimentation and testing. The draft will not go anywhere as long as it remains active(edited at least once every six months). 331dot (talk) 12:12, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

okay, thanks I appreciate 🙏🏿❤️ Draykaayrg (talk) 12:13, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello, please are you still here with me?

I got a question to ask please 🙏🏿 Draykaayrg (talk) 15:11, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

WP:TOOSOON addresses the situations of musicians, actors, authors, etc. who may be article-worthing in the future, but not yet. David notMD (talk) 12:07, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

If you change you mind about ever submitting the draft you can request that it be deleted by putting DB-author inside double curly brackets {{ }} at the top, and an Administrator will deleted it. David notMD (talk) 14:12, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

No I won't submit it Draykaayrg (talk) 14:21, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Because I don't have reliable citation and I'm also scared of getting banned from editing Wikipedia 😥 Draykaayrg (talk) 14:23, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Please I'm truly sorry please 🙏🏿

What if I submit it what will happen? Draykaayrg (talk) 14:37, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello please I'm sorry

I'm feeling guilty of my previous response 🙏🏿 Draykaayrg (talk) 14:57, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Please I don't know, what will happen when If I submit my article and wasn't accepted? Will be page be blocked or they'll list the area I need to improve will Draykaayrg (talk) 15:03, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@Draykaayrg There is no danger of you being blocked for making good faith attempts to create an article, even an autobiography. You will only run into trouble if you repeatedly submit the draft when you have already been told it doesn't meet our requirements owing to your current lack of wikinotability. You can tweak the draft over the coming months and submit it when you believe that hurdle has been overcome. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:14, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Okay thanks I won't submit it Draykaayrg (talk) 15:18, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Deletion of an Article

Hi team,

I've added an article with title Bridge India, but it keeps getting removed. Can I get what exact thing I must do to keep it live and prevent it's removal? Prathmesh9309 (talk) 14:43, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@Prathmesh9309 Welcome to the Teahouse. There are several messages about this on your Talk Page and the links to the deletion discussions give information suggesting that experienced editors thought the content was promotional, not encyclopaedic. Please read carefully the links at the top of your Talk Page about what is expected in articles (summarised at WP:YFA). Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:09, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Please can I ask you a question please 🙏🏿 Draykaayrg (talk) 15:13, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@Draykaayrg Please do so in your own thread (above) so as not to confuse your question with Prathmesh9309's. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:18, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Ok I won't Draykaayrg (talk) 15:20, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Your article was moved to Draft:Bridge India. Work on it there and submit it for review, but not before you address all the concerns in Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bridge India. ~Anachronist (talk) 06:48, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Hurricane Katrina

I have edited the "Hurricane Katrina" wiki article many times, but now I am being told that only autoconfirmed users can edit it. How do I earn that status? Sheldonville (talk) 15:14, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@Sheldonville You are well beyond the threshold for WP:AUTOCONFIRMed and should have no trouble continuing to edit Hurricane Katrina. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:20, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Citing an external PDF as a source

Hi everyone, I'm new to Wikipedia and have a question about how I would reference a source. I'm working on improving the page Split Oak Forest, and it mentions the group Friends of Split Oak Forest as a relevant community organization. I'm trying to document when Friends of Split Oak Forest was created as an organization. It appears to have been started in 2018, per this IRS document confirming its 501(c)(3) status, but I'm unsure of how I would create a reference for this source. Also, would it be suitable to upload this IRS PDF record to Wikimedia Commons to preserve it as a reference? Thanks in advance for the answers. Prosochē (talk) 15:53, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Picture

Hi I upload a picture I made on Wikimedia Commons on my personal page. I tried to link it to an article in Wikipedia as I already did many times, but it shows only as a downloadable/clicable line of text instead of a thumbnail... On Wikimedia Commons, my picture shows properly, but for an unknown reason I can't seems to be able to use it on Wikipedia... Can someone help me by explaining me what I do wrong? Thanks F. M F Gervais (talk) 16:06, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

M F Gervais, there's a file on Commons at https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:M_F_Gervais_Monarchs_of_Spain.pdf but it's 0 × 0 pixels. Is that the one you're tryinhg to use? Maproom (talk) 17:45, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Yes, but on commons it seems to show properly? Or did I do something wrong? M F Gervais (talk) 18:24, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

For me, it does not show properly, or indeed at all, on Commons. As its size is reported as 0x0 pixels, I'm not surprised. Maproom (talk) 19:48, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I've just found that I can download it from Commons, and then view it in Chrome. Something is wrong somewhere (but not at en:Wikipedia). I suggest you ask about it on the Help Desk at Commons. Maproom (talk) 20:00, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@M F Gervais, ask for help on Commons at their Village Pump. It is very strange. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:M_F_Gervais_Monarchs_of_Spain.pdf says it has 0x0 pixels but links to https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/81/M_F_Gervais_Monarchs_of_Spain.pdf which is all there. StarryGrandma (talk) 20:05, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@M F Gervais: MediaWiki tries to display PDF files as a PNG image of one of the pages. Something in the file appears to be incompatible with MediaWiki so this conversion doesn't work. I don't know whether the problem is in the file or MediaWiki. Anyway, PDF is not an image format but a file format which can hold multi-page documents. It's better to upload an image file like PNG or JPG if a PDF file is only used for one image. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:26, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Bfdi

Can There ever be an article of Bfdi the animated series by following the Article rules? 2001:56A:FB31:8600:44C6:4D9B:4F3A:A78E (talk) 16:47, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

If you haven't already, see Wikipedia:Why is BFDI not on Wikipedia?. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 17:06, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Is my request done correctly?

Plz see

Talk:History of Palestine#"Palestine" Is Not a Country Johnywhy (talk) 16:58, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

It was opposed and  Not done for the reason of

Not done. Wikipedia is not here for you to push a POV, make WP:FORUM speeches or to berate other editors. Edit requests need to be simple and straightforward, require no argumentation and EC editors will decide whether to implement them. Babysharkboss2 was here!! ^{I killed JFK} 13:02, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Help needed in creating an article.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Lori_A._Williams The declined response said it read like an article. I thought that was the purpose. What do you suggest I do to change this submission?Draft:Lori A. Williams Is there someone who is able to assist? Meep2024 (talk) 17:05, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Meep2024. What the reviewer actually said was This submission appears to read more like an advertisement than an entry in an encyclopedia. I agree with the reviewer. Your draft has a promotional tone, and you should carefully read the Neutral point of view, which is a core content policy. Edit your draft accordingly. Cullen328 (talk) 17:44, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

How can Edit Requests Exclude Reasons?

I was told that edit requests should not include reasons for the requested edit. How does that make any sense? Johnywhy (talk) 17:06, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello. Who told you this, and where?(could you link to it?) 331dot (talk) 17:07, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Looks like it was on your user talk page. What they mean is that edit requests are for edits that are simple and uncontroversial- where the reason is obvious. If you have to give a lot of reasons, it's not simple and should be handled with a discussion to establish a consensus, not an edit request. 331dot (talk) 17:11, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

"should be handled with a discussion"

How and where do i initiate that discussion?

Johnywhy (talk) 17:13, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Johnywhy, you are not an Extended confirmed editor, and therefore you are not permitted to engage in substantive discussions about articles in the Arab/Israeli conflict topic area until you reach that status. Only then can you begin such a discussion. Cullen328 (talk) 17:33, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@Johnywhy A better link to explain Extended Confirmed is at WP:XC. Mike Turnbull (talk) 17:37, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Is it correct to say that a person who isn't an Extended Confirmed editor may submit edit requests using the Edit Request Wizard for Protected pages? Johnywhy (talk) 01:28, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

@Johnywhy: Editors that aren't extended confirmed are allowed to make edit requests in controversial areas, provided that the request is not controversial. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 01:52, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

See WP:EDITXY Selfstudier (talk) 10:53, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Finding a non-controversial edit related to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict will likely be difficult- that's why the topic area has such stringent restrictions. The community needs to see that you can edit dispassionately before permitting you to contribute in that area- that's the reason for the EC restrictons. If you think your proposed edit is at all controversial- meaning that its entirely possible someone could disagree with it- you shouldn't request it. As a practical matter that would be limited to things like spelling or grammar fixes, nothing substantive. 331dot (talk) 11:02, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Main article for category is broken link

So I was looking at this category https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Culture_of_Palestine_(region) and it says the main article is Culture of Palestine (region), which doesn't exist. The correct main article is Culture of Palestine. Is there anything I can do to fix this broken link? Therealteal (talk) 17:52, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I think I fixed it. The Cat Main template has a parameter to use if the title of the category is different from the title of the main article. Uporządnicki (talk) 18:17, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Awesome. Thanks. I had no idea how to fix that. Therealteal (talk) 18:22, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Looking for an editor to write an article (Short Bio and Work)

Hi there, I'm looking for an editor to write an article (Short Bio and Work) on Wikipedia since we can do it ourselves. Ideally I want to pay adequatively a contribution that can help Wikipedia itself. Can you help? Arnaud Ahmed Segla (talk) 19:15, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

In general, we're not keen on paid editing (it's barely tolerated). In particular, if a subject isn't notable enough for a Wikipedia article, then paying someone isn't going to fix that. -- D'n'B-t -- 19:45, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

You were not notable in Wikipedia terms back in 2019 when you first attempted an article, it is clear from a quick Google search that this is still the case, be VERY wary of paying someone to create this for you, you will be scammed and you will still not have an article about you. Theroadislong (talk) 19:58, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Theroadislong is right, and what he says is well-intentioned. Now that you've posted here, you may be contacted privately by scammers. (A well-intentioned person would respond here.) Maproom (talk) 20:04, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Contributions to Wikipedia and the encyclopedias (English and all others) are entirely separate entities. Contributing to the former has no impact on the latter. David notMD (talk) 01:15, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Proper citation

I'm making an edit on a page, but need assistance with proper citation. Note this article; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Webcomics_are_no_good_as_sources.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muses_in_popular_culture#:~:text=A%20character%20from%20the%20internet%20fiction%20series%20Homestuck%20is%20named%20Calliope,%20since%20they%20are%20a%20%22Muse%20of%20Space%22. This article is about references to the greek muses in popular culture. The fact stated is without a doubt true, but the above article says "Webcomic characters aren't "noted experts" of the fiction they live in" To fix the citation I could quote the webcomic page directly, or a fandom page on the character. I've never cited a page before as well and require assistance. TerraFantasy (talk) 20:12, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

In this one case, you could likely cite the comic itself. The primary citation does not establish notability, however. You could also try looking around the internet for sources. Do not use Fandom as it is User Generated Content. ✶Quxyz✶ 20:26, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

There is not alot of info on how to cite webcomics. Would I use the citation rules for normal comic strips? TerraFantasy (talk) 20:28, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

If you are on the visual editor, if you click on the quote button and then click on website, you can just fill in all the information. Note that fanmade or pirated content would not be able to be cited; but if it is an online version of a text published by the original author it can be cited per WP:Primary on a limited number of basic things. To switch between visual and source editor, you can click a dropdown button near the top on the screen. ✶Quxyz✶ 21:11, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Formatting help.

How can I turn the footnote 13 in this article into a "note 1" note and why is it broken ? https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Fusajiro_Yamauchi&oldid=1223861452 Maxime12346 (talk) 20:33, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@Maxime12346, for putting it into a note, see Help:Footnotes#Footnotes: groups. StarryGrandma (talk) 20:39, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

@Maxime12346, and for putting references correctly inside a note see Help:Footnotes#Footnotes: embedding references. StarryGrandma (talk) 20:43, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I used this to make my edit : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Explanatory_notes. How are these different and in which cases should they be used ? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Explanatory_notes Maxime12346 (talk) 20:52, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Linked accounts in languages I don't speak

Hi, I accidentally created local Wikipedia accounts of languages I don't speak from my global Wikipedia account. Is there a way to remove them?

Thanks in advance! Nelisd8 (talk) 21:18, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi Nelisd8, welcome to the Teahouse. A local account is automatically created if you view any page while already logged in at a Wikimedia wiki. It's normal to have a lot of accounts created this way. They cannot be removed. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:12, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Formating help again.

I have been reading the Footnotes pages again and again and I can't see what is wrong. Why won't the [13] turns into [note 1] ? Why is there an error message ? What is wrong here ? https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Fusajiro_Yamauchi&oldid=1223880271 Please tell me the exact thing that is wrong and what characters I need to change exactly to make this work. I need you to be very clear because of my autism. Maxime12346 (talk) 22:46, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Maxime12346, your question is somewhat confused, so let's take this stage by stage. In one "Cite web" template, you have website=https://www.jti.com/about-us. That produces a syntax error, because the value of the attribute "website" may not be a URL. Correct it to, for example, website=JTI. (I am assuming that you are editing the "source". I know nothing about the "visual editor".) -- Hoary (talk) 23:59, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Making one of those biography boxes on the left of almost every Wikipedia article.

I don't know what it's called but, in my work, creating an article of Ayten Gökçer I want to know how to make one of those boxes on the far left of almost ever Wikipedia article that contains a picture and info about that topic. Advice for creating one would help with some of my other work too but if you want to make on yourself with this article please tell me how to make one for future use. Thanks, Fewsnake. Fewsnake (talk) 22:59, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi Fewsnake. Those are called infoboxes. There are a ton of them, each tuned to the types of information most appropriate for a certain type of article. One way to learn exactly how it's done (what information to put in each fied, etc.) is to look at a page of interest in the wiki editor. For an actor, that would be {{Infobox person}}. DMacks (talk) 23:25, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you so much! This is really helpful! Fewsnake (talk) 23:28, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Is it better to edit Wikipedia with a tablet or a laptop and what operating system is best?

I'm curious to hear from you whether it is better to edit with a tablet (maybe with a keyboard) or a laptop. I currently have a laptop running Windows and I know that editing Wikipedia on a smartphone isn't ideal since editing is designed for bigger screens. The boundary between a tablet and a laptop is blurring since you can do basic tasks easily with both devices. I'm curious to know if anyone has edited Wikipedia with an iPad or Android, a Mac, or a Chromebook and their opinions on editing. What are some things you can do easily with those platforms and what are some challenges related to editing that should be noted? Interstellarity (talk) 23:27, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I edit on a computer, and I think that it is superior. It has more data processing so it's less laggy. The keys are easy to edit quickly with and the screen is big enough for any article. The only downside is that it is not that portable. (Laptops are probably "technically portable" because of their small size.) Fewsnake (talk) 23:31, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Whether or not the device has a full-sized keyboard is the most important for me. By "full-sized" I don't mean whether or not it's as big as a (now antique) Northgate keyboard; I'm referring to the distance between the centre of the Q key and the centre of the P key (assuming that it's a Qwerty layout). I might prefer the combination of full-sized keyboard and the OS I loathe most to that of miniaturized input device and the OS I like most. (My laptop is "practicably portable" because of its small size and trivial weight; but I move it around very little as I don't want to risk having its SSD fall in the wrong hands.) If you're tired of Windows, note that you can install an alternative OS. Please don't attempt to start a discussion about which OS is best; you'll find discussions ad nauseam if you care to look for them. -- Hoary (talk) 23:51, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Here is a different perspective: I have done the vast majority of my editing for many years on smartphones. I have written many articles including Good articles on smartphones. I became an active administrator six years ago on a smartphone. I have answered thousands of questions here at the Teahouse and also at the Help Desk on smartphones. A smartphone is a miniature computer. I wrote an essay called User:Cullen328/Smartphone editing. Cullen328 (talk) 23:56, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

I always edit with a laptop. I start with off-line documents stored on my computer where I collect all my notes from various reliable references. If I have trouble finding needed data I may spend months working on a note file. If I’m going to rewrite a paragraph or two of an article I first work on it offline so that I don’t feel rushed to finish a project before I’ve put sufficient time into it. (I do search for online reliable sources to use in my offline projects, plus I have a collection of printed reference books on favorite subjects.)

I usually have multiple Wikipedia projects I’m working on offline, for sometimes I temporarily set aside some of them, if I become more motivated to work on a different subject. I am an older Baby Boomer female editor, and spent most of my writing life without Internet in my home, so I never got out of the habit of working offline before its time to publish my work. This is what works for me, but everyone needs to find the process that they are most comfortable with.

Karenthewriter (talk) 00:11, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you everyone for sharing your opinions. I appreciate it. Interstellarity (talk) 09:29, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

How does OR works? Pl. join @ WP:NORN

Requesting experienced users, who know how OR and synth works, to pitch in a little at No original research/Noticeboard, since the question asked likely to be interest of new as well as experienced users both. Bookku (talk) 04:01, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Template parameter formatting

Hello! I hope your day is good. I am trying make a userbox, and I am learning template parameters. I have the userbox in my sandbox. I want there to be a parameter where the user can write it like {{[...]quadball|position}} and it will read as "This user plays quadball as a position" and they can fill in position with whatever they like. I've managed to get that after some learning, but I'd like the template to also be able to just say "This user plays quadball" if no parameter is filled in, but I've read through WP:PARAMETER and I'm still stuck. This is an exercise for me in learning templates, so please explain how it works even if it is not possible in userboxes. Thank you so much!! -- NotCharizard ^🗨 04:24, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Just to make sure I understand, you will have two parameters, identified by position (1 and 2) rather than name. You want to display some text that contains the first parameter. And you want to display some text that contains the second parameter but only display if there is a second parameter given. The positional parameters are identified as {{{1}}} and {{{2}}}. Each of those expands to whatever value is passed, so you can write "foo {{{1}}} bar" and the value of the first parameter will be filled in. If no value is passed, it expands to nothing. You can use conditional expressions to take different actions depending on various values. See Help:Conditional expressions#Using #if for an example of checking whether a parameter has a value. DMacks (talk) 04:46, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

The link for using the "if" parameter is exactly what I needed! Thank you so much!! I'm super greatful. -- NotCharizard ^🗨 05:02, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

How to create a Wikipedia page for a public figure?

Hello,

How do I create a Wikipedia page for a public figure in India? I tried creating one in Sandbox and it got declined.

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User%3AKumarmk%2Fsandbox&oldid=prev&diff=1223923706

Best,

Kiran Kumar Kumarmk (talk) 06:13, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

@Kumarmk Have you read and understood the reason it was declined? That contains the things you need to do. Please read HELP:YFA as well, and return to this thread if anything is unclear. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 06:18, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Your draft User:Kumarmk/sandbox completely fails every one of the points made in WP:Golden Rule. ~Anachronist (talk) 06:42, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Unless you can provide references to what people have written about him, there is no potential for your draft to be accepted. David notMD (talk) 10:52, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

New rules to question reliable sources?

I am very confused. For a second time recently (two or three days) cited content is removed from Lillie Rosa Minoka Hill - or cited content is modified without a new source here and here - because the users are assuming that she is:

• not Mohawk, although there are reliable sources, and it's said in everything I have read about her so far
• Due to federal government Blood quantum laws and her mixed-race heritage - her father is Quaker - she is not a citizen of any Native American tribe. That is true and cited in the article. It was a means of limiting the number of people that could vote on issues relating to them. I think they are taking this to mean that she's not a Native American, but again, there are sources that she's a Native American, she worked for clinics and befriended many "other Native American" women
• "Minoka was the second Native American woman in the United States to obtain a medical degree, after Susan La Flesche Picotte (Omaha)". - is cited in the body of the article but removed again from the intro and "known for". There is no other known person that I am aware of that has this distinction (i.e., there's not a group of Native American or other American people that wanted to ignore her)

Because of the assumptions, they have said that Minoka-Hill is a self-identified Mohawk, when it appears that is all she has ever been told about herself, from her mother's side of the family. This, I think, is the crux of the issue and relates to this essay. I don't see in this essay that cited content should be removed become of someone's thoughts.

This last time was after I posted a message here at the Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Indigenous peoples of North America page. I question trying to remove content based upon unpublished beliefs as what seem to me to be verifiability and original research issues.

Sorry this is long. Has something changed that I am unaware of? At first, I really thought it was possible I was being pranked. The first person (we had extended talk page conversation at Talk:Lillie Rosa Minoka Hill is not a new user who is unaware of Wikipedia guidelines.

Please help - I wasn't sure if this is a third-opinion, ANI, or some other issue. How should this be handled? I feel like I can make the corrections and the article will be modified again.–CaroleHenson (talk) 06:37, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

I could post a don't remove cited content and sources needed for new content message, but I am just not wanting to take the wrong step here. Is that appropriate here - or is some kind of review needed first about why this is happening?–CaroleHenson (talk) 06:40, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello, CaroleHenson. I am not sure why you think that the Teahouse is the place for a complex content assessment which belongs at Talk: Lillie Rosa Minoka Hill, not here. That being said, the article in its current form is shot through with subjective and non-neutral assertions. Somebody willing to dig into the reliable sources about this person needs to do a major cleanup to bring the article into compliance with the Neutral point of view which is a core content policy. Cullen328 (talk) 07:00, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Cullen328, Thanks so much for responding. I didn't know where to go.

I just posted a message about returning "self-identifying Mohawk" uncited / within an existing source that doesn't cover that.

I was just about to work on "tone" - which sounds like where you are coming from. Is there a source or sources that you think should be removed from the article?

How can I do the work if the article continues to add uncited content?

Thanks so much! Well, it makes me feel better that it's complex - like this isn't out of the blue.–CaroleHenson (talk) 07:13, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

CaroleHenson, Wikipedia articles do not add content themselves because they are not sentient entities. Human beings add content. Engage in discussion with those other human beings at Talk: Lillie Rosa Minoka Hill as I recommended earlier. Only if that is not effective should you then try the various forms of dispute resolution that are available to you. In other words, do your best to try to resolve the dispute with the other editor first. Cullen328 (talk) 07:32, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Gotcha about working through the issues, I took a stab at that here. I posted a message on one of the user's talk page. I will copy that to the article talk page.

If you have some specific feedback about the problem - specific sources you think shouldn't be used, etc. that would be nice.–CaroleHenson (talk) 07:44, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Never mind, Oncamera is taking over. Thanks for your help.–CaroleHenson (talk) 08:15, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Article might have to be draft-ified, it's far from suitable for Wikipedia article standards.  oncamera  _{(talk page)} 08:29, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Per sources like [2][3], WP:GNG shouldn't be a problem. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 08:48, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Multiple uses of "efn" template

Is it possible to reference the same "efn" footnote more than once, without the note appearing twice in the Notes section? Wafflewombat (talk) 07:06, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

An "Efn" note? Yes. As a ferinstance:

He claimed to have learned Hamlet, in its entirety, by the age of ten.{{efn|name=precocity_debate|The claim has been questioned; see "[[#Doubts|Doubts]]".}} He also claimed to have piloted his mother's Cessna at twelve.{{efn|name=precocity_debate}}

-- Hoary (talk) 08:24, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Awesome, thank you! Wafflewombat (talk) 08:51, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Edit request

I have made an edit request on the Ahir talk page but it got no reply nor did anyone add to it. Can anyone help me here? Can anyone add my edit request to the Ahir article? Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2409:4085:8d1d:4b36::8849:da09 (talk) 07:12, May 15, 2024

Hello. Your edit request was not properly formatted and is likely to be ignored. An edit request should say "Change specific language X to specific language Y, and reliable source Z verifies the change I want to make". So, make your edit request that way with a template, and maybe another editor will respond. Cullen328 (talk) 07:39, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Our Wikipage Rejecting issue how to solve

I am already many times try to create our organization Wikipedia new page, but not successful our page was rejected always. our Wikipedia page was "P. Naveenkumar. M.E (Atchayam Trust)". this name display in google . but our content not showing. how to rectify. please help to guide me. HomeforAtchayam2014 (talk) 08:33, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Your draft Draft:Atchayam Home (Atchayam Trust) is blatant promotion, Wikipedia is not a platform for marketing your organisation. Theroadislong (talk) 08:37, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

I noticed the "many times" bit, are you related to Arulkrishna2096? Pahunkat (talk) 08:43, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

@HomeforAtchayam2014 In early May I rejected five drafts you have created and marked each for deletion. Stop creating these. Qcne (talk) 10:32, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Indef blocked. David notMD (talk) 11:01, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

The use of "Fox" vs "FOX" for Fox Corporation brands

One of the edits I made while editing "List of 9-1-1 episodes" was shortening the hotlink "Fox Broadcasting Company" to "FOX". After revisiting this page, I began to wonder if the title should be typed in as "Fox" or as "FOX"? After investigating and reviewing the different websites for the Fox Corporation brands, I discovered they all use "FOX" except for when talking about the name of the Fox Corporation itself throughout it's own website, https://www.foxcorporation.com/businesses/, https://www.foxcorporation.com/management/executive-team/, https://investor.foxcorporation.com/static-files/59e636f7-2b1f-455e-b140-5e39a80d8975.

By selecting the About Us hotlink within the Fox Corporation website, https://www.foxcorporation.com/about-us/, it takes you to a page that demonstrates the use of "FOX" when talking about its brands:

"Under the FOX banner, we produce and distribute content through some of the world’s leading and most valued brands, including: FOX News Media, FOX Sports, FOX Entertainment, FOX Television Stations and Tubi Media Group. We empower a diverse range of creators to imagine and develop culturally significant content, while building an organization that thrives on creative ideas, operational expertise and strategic thinking..."

To me this implies that "Fox" as used in Fox Corporation is the only iteration where this happens. All other Fox Corporation brands use "FOX". This would included FOX News Media, FOX Sports, FOX Entertainment, FOX Television Stations and even the FOX Broadcasting Company. It should also be noted that Fox Corporation refers to itself as "FOX" throughout its website. An example of this can also be found in second paragraph of the About Use page:

"...We have long been a leader in news, sports and entertainment programming, achieving strong revenue growth and profitability in a complex industry environment over the past several years. FOX will continue to invest across our businesses, allocate resources toward investments in higher growth initiatives and take advantage of strategic opportunities, including potential acquisitions across the range of the media categories in which we operate."

My question is whether or not the use of "Fox" should be changed to "FOX" in all instances where it is found site wide except for Fox Corporation? This would include but not limited to:

Fox Broadcasting Company, Fox News Media, Fox Sports, Fox Entertainment, and Fox Television Stations.

knighstalker (talk) 10:11, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

@KnighsTalker: MOS:ALLCAPS and MOS:TMRULES say it should be "Fox". Bazza 7 (talk) 11:07, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Wiki was not accepted due to not enough coverage

This is for the coach in the article, are these articles sufficient?

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/4855322/2023/09/14/madueke-chelsea-isaksson-hurst-skills/

ttps://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-7815755/Meet-150-hour-private-coach-working-Premier-League-stars-academy-wonderkids.html

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/12922548/folarin-balogun-one-of-the-most-exciting-number-nines-in-world-football

Please see bio below.

Many thanks!

Saul Isaksson Hurst is an individual skills development coach and has coached in Premier League Academy Football clubs including Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham Hotspur FC. He now works one-to-one and his clients include Premier League Serie A and Ligue 1 players including Samuel Iling Jnr (Juventus) Noni Madueke (Chelsea) Flo Balogun (Monaco), Reiss Nelson (Arsenal) Max Aarons (Bournemouth) Rico Henry (Brentford) Saul is regarded as one of the worlds leaders in individual development. Saul also works with Professional Football Clubs and Federations as a consultant supporting individual technical development. He founded the app Mypersonalfootballcoach in 2013. An app created to improve technical football skills which has been utilised by the Academies of clubs including Arsenal FC. Rosalinda19 90 (talk) 13:06, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Rosalinda19 90: the first one, I can't tell, as it's behind a paywall. The other two do little to help establish the subject's notability, as they're based on what the subject said, and so not independent. Maproom (talk) 15:29, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

I'd say the NYT counts, it's a lot of "he says" but there is coverage of him in there too. The Skysport is just him talking, and then there's the WP:DAILYMAIL. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 16:10, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Links diverting

Hi Guys,

I'm new to Wikipedia editing but have some time in web development etc. I've noticed an article that has external links diverting to different sites to what they are listed for.

White-collar boxing

This article has a link claiming to be to London Evening Standard and another to white collar boxing charity championship. Should I just delete these links?

Sorry if this is an obvious question i just wanted to check before I made the edit.

Many thanks

@DAMOP12 DAMOP12 (talk) 14:46, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi DAMOP12, welcome to the Teahouse. Thanks for your interest and asking. Many websites die or remove pages. Sometimes the domain is taken over and gets unrelated content. We usually don't just remove dead links but mark them as dead or look for a replacement. See Wikipedia:Link rot. The London Evening Standard link shows the title was "The Gloves are on – London's Boxing Boom". A Google search easily found https://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/the-gloves-are-on-londons-boxing-boom-6384731.html. PrimeHunter (talk) 15:33, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Article assessed as a redirect over 3 years ago

There was an article I have recently created (1997 Prairie Dell-Jarrell tornado) which was assessed as a redirect 3 years ago and doesn't show up as "unassesed" anywhere else do to this. Is there a way to fix that, or remove the "redirect" assessment? Thanks! :) MemeGod ._. (My talk page, my contributions and my creations!) 15:06, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

@MemeGod27: What makes you think it's assessed as a redirect? Talk:1997 Prairie Dell-Jarrell tornado is in several categories for unassessed articles. PrimeHunter (talk) 15:20, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

On the "page statistics" tool, it says it was already assessed as a redirect, and if I am correct then it won't show up on the respective project pages, and it will most likely not be rated for an extended period of time. MemeGod ._. (My talk page, my contributions and my creations!) 15:29, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

@MemeGod27: I don't know where that tool gets the assessment data from but there was a redirect version today [4] and the talk page apparently needed a null edit to update link tables so I have done that. The assesment has now changed in the tool. The talk page is in many categories like Category:Unassessed Texas articles where editors can find it but I don't know where interested editors are most likely to look. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:01, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Ah, that must be why. Thanks! :D MemeGod ._. (My talk page, my contributions and my creations!) 16:05, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

If you want to get an article assessed you can always ask at Wikipedia:WikiProject Wikipedia/Assessment#Requesting an assessment. Reconrabbit 17:07, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Cluster sources

How to cluster multiple citations and sources leading to different websites into one note? I have already seen many help pages but I think they are not of the 'normal webpage citation' format I want. Thanks, ExclusiveEditor _{Notify Me!} 15:56, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

I think you use multiple {{Cite web}} templates inside a single <ref></ref>. Best, ayakanaa ( t ) 16:06, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

@ExclusiveEditor No, the best way to do this is via a WP:CITEBUNDLE, with use of the template {{Unbulleted list citebundle}}. Mike Turnbull (talk) 16:09, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Can you help tell if this photo is copyrighted?

I want to upload this photo but dont want it to get deleted is there in an easy way to tell if its copyrighted? please help soon. Thank you!

Emihovich at UF

Shane emihovich (talk) 18:10, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Shane emihovich. Yes, the photo is copyrighted because it is not in the public domain. The file page says that the photo is your own work and also says This file is licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 4.0 International license. Did you take this photo yourself? If so, it is properly licensed. If not, the license is invalid and the photo must be deleted. Cullen328 (talk) 18:19, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

The photo appears on this website, which contains a copyright notice. Cullen328 (talk) 18:26, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

User:Shane emihovich Well, in the strictest sense, it almost certainly is, since basically, anything with a modicum of creativity is under copyright the moment it's set down in some fixed form. Formally registering a work for copyright does provide benefits, but it doesn't MAKE copyright. This photograph does not look nearly old enough that copyright would have expired. Uporządnicki (talk) 18:24, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Inquery

Hello, I came on the Teahouse to question about links and how to mask the link. I want to be able to add a link into text so when you click on the text it brings you to the link. IS this possible? GoodHue291 (talk) 18:11, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

yes. Try WP:PIPE. Babysharkboss2 was here!! ^{I killed JFK} 19:03, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

I need someone to upload a image of a Morula echinata to the Wikimedia Commons

funny story im banned from the Commons so can someone please help Dr Jackson is not rweal (talk) 20:41, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

No, we won't help you to evade your block or ban from Commons. 331dot (talk) 20:47, 15 May 2024 (UTC)